Comments on: Education Pt. 2

By: Darren Torpey

Darren Torpey — Sat, 09 Apr 2005 06:14:00 +0000

Actually, Craig, according to Henry Jenkins, some educators (some of the ones he's talked to) are making the identification and understanding of biases a part of the overall education. He mentioned that, along with many other really neat things that gave me th Civ idea, when he came to talk at WPI recently.

Of course, this doesn't mean that all educators will be so forward thinking and brave, but that can never be helped. There is no magic bullet for incompetency, corruption, and laziness. =)

By: Craig Perko

Craig Perko — Fri, 08 Apr 2005 22:41:00 +0000

Well, I certainly have no way to intervene. Educational games are going to be made eventually, and eventually they won't all suck.

But I don't have the faith in the teachers you do. If they make identifying bias part of the education, I will buy you dinner every night of that year's GDC.

No hard feelings about the clash of ideals, I hope.

By: Darius Kazemi

Darius Kazemi — Fri, 08 Apr 2005 22:36:00 +0000

Okay, but your argument boils down to (1) either we stop teaching history, period, or (2) we ignore the issue and teach what we think is right, or at least teach what is set by the curriculum.

I mean, every high school history textbook is notoriously biased. Keep in mind that these games by Muzzy Lane are for late high school and college students, who for the most part should be able to make up their minds as to biases anyway. In fact, I'll bet part of any educational usage of the games would involve identifying biases inherent in the model, and possibly an exercise involving removing the biases.

By: Craig Perko

Craig Perko — Fri, 08 Apr 2005 21:11:00 +0000

Hmm, I guess you’re right on that. I just can’t figure out how to make a computer game teach liberal arts (such as history) while having ANY use other than political indoctrination. It seems like it would JUST be indoctrination.

What are they planning on teaching? History? I can’t think of a single portrayal of a historical event which isn’t just politics. Introducing ‘other ways of looking at it’ will just make it MORE political.

By: Darius Kazemi

Darius Kazemi — Fri, 08 Apr 2005 20:29:00 +0000

I hate to be rude, but so the hell what? ALL teaching is politically biased! Especially teaching about politics. All teaching about politics (and even all teaching not about politics) end up being about political indoctrination.

By: Craig Perko

Craig Perko — Fri, 08 Apr 2005 20:13:00 +0000

Unfortunately, these kinds of simulations always have serious political leanings – even if by accident. For example, war has a lot of different effects on the culture of a nation… but exactly what those effects are is hotly contested depending on your political point of view. And these points of view are NOT compatible.

Sure, I have a preference that I believe is based on logic, but so do they. The game will end up as political indoctrination no matter which of us makes it. Kids, who are especially susceptable, will almost certainly fall for it hook, line, and sinker.